BaseballBats
04-12-2006, 03:09 AM
Note This post was brought over from the old message board.
I'm looking to buy a -3 easton Stealth. Does anyone know performance wise the difference between the stiff and regular flex stealths? or does anyone have an opinion?
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Haven't got enough feedback to compare.
I know most people like them...
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I am pretty sure that the handle or shaft of the bat is pretty much like a golf club shaft. The "regular" flex, or the "stiff" flex obviously refers to the amount of give that a bat has, like a golf club. In my experience, the regular flex is "considered" better for power hitters because it gives them more "snap" on contact. But to me, that is really in a sense a contradictory statement due to the fact that a true power hitter should posess enough snap with his wrist's and have enough power generated throughout his swing with his core and legs that he should not need the extra snap offered by a regular flex bat. So, personally, I think it is a matter of personal preference on how the bat responds to your swing and point of contact. Hope this is somewhat helpful.
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In golf...(imho) the stiffer stuff is for the harder / power swingers.
Check out tiger's or whoever's swing....thier clubs flex but not much.
Question 13: Ok, let's get off the golf swing. I'm looking to purchase a new set of clubs. What's the number 1 thing I should consider before everything else?
The shaft flex beyond a doubt. The shaft is the "engine" of the club. For the record, most players play with a shaft flex which is too stiff and they're unable to "load" the shaft properly for a long, powerful hit. But shaft flex is not entirely dependent on how fast you swing the club. For example, Fred Couples plays a weaker shaft than Nick Price who plays a stiffer shaft, even though Price generates less clubhead speed! Couples swings relatively slowly while Price swings fast. Couples, amazingly enough, though, generates more clubhead speed than Price but needs a weaker shaft because he swings the club so slowly.
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I agree WNYCoach. This is why I said that "in my experience, the regular flex shaft is considered" to be for power hitters. I did not make myself very clear until later when I mentioned that this was contradictory. Sorry for the confusion.
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Distance isn't everything in golf, stiffer shaft = more accurcacy and possibly less distance. Those guys are looking for a balance between distance and accuracy.
Don't forget that you're dealing with a longer flexing shaft in golf than with a baseball bat. In a golf club's shaft, there is maore involved than simply its flex. There are kick points and torque involved also. Kick point determines trajectory and torque determines the club head's twist which translates into accuracy. Those don't play as big a role in baseball bat flex handles because they're shorter.
You're not thinking club speed either, you're thinking tempo. Tempo in a golf swing has absolutley nothing to do with what shaft you need. Price swings "faster" because he has a quicker tempo than Couples. In reality, Couples has a faster club speed, so he's using a stiffer shaft, not a weaker shaft than Price, check your source there. Here's another problem with what you're saying: If Price is swinging a weaker shaft than Couples and Price swings faster, then either Price would be slicing the ball because the clubhead would be dragging too much, or Couples would be hooking the ball because the clubhead wouldn't be dragging enough. I would really like to know where you got your information from on those two because it simply doesn't make sense.
Rule of thumb: The more bat head speed you have the stiffer handle bat you want because you don't want the barrel to drag through the zone. More bat head speed = more distance. More distance = power hitter. Therefore a power hitter wants a bat with a stiffer handle.
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Easton's stiff handle option is a marketing response to the basic engineering/physics problem - a stiff handle is generally a better design in a baseball bat.
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im a high school payer (sophmore) and it seems like everyone thats anyone around here is buying the stiff handles. ive tried both out. the regular handle is good for opposite field hits becuase of the bend. but i think the stiff one is better all around.
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bat will barely flex. can u bend it even using ur foot!? Compar flex on a golf club shaft.
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Plaz...it's not just during the swing...it's during contact!!! That's the problem, the handle flexes at contact and the barrel trampoline effect has decreased it's effect on the ball. I can flex my son's old Vexum -13 with a hand at each end.
Search for Physics of Baseball and Sweet spot to learn about that topicc
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Right thats a kids bat. I dont think an adult bat will flex. The bat needs to flex before it hits the ball to help it. So that it can "unflex" at the release point which gives it the extra whip, stored potential energy. Now is the ball hit at the release point? Proly not... would be hard. If the bat flexes when it hits the ball ( between the handle and the sweet spot ) I realy dont think its gana unflex before the ball leaves the bat. I may be wrong proly am.. but maybe right . its a fun discussion. but coming from golf and seeing lots of customized shafts, I dont see how flex can have anything to do with it. Large sweet spot would be more potential distance over a series of many hits.
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I just got through reading a bunch of stuff on bat physics, BESR certification, etc. A discussion on stiff versus flex probably needs to be divided into two categories. BESR certified bats and non-BESR certified bats. If you are talking about BESR certified bats then all bats perform the same as a 34 inch wood bat because that is the limiting standard for ball exit speed. Then the discussion may need to revolve around durability of the bat and the ability of the bat to maintain new bat performance.
If you are talking about non-BESR bats then there is some variation of ball exit speed depending on whose physics you are buying. For non-BESR bats, it looks like stiff bats are better than flex bats, because this allows the barrel to flex more increasing the trampoline effect. The worst that can happen is a flex bat that flexes too much on impact absorbing the collision energy and cannot rebound fast enough to return the energy to the ball (dead bat). Probably the interesting thing is that it appears that BESR certified bats will not perform as well as non-certified bats because BESR bats have been scaled back to perform the same as wood bats.
I'm looking to buy a -3 easton Stealth. Does anyone know performance wise the difference between the stiff and regular flex stealths? or does anyone have an opinion?
-----------------------------------------
Haven't got enough feedback to compare.
I know most people like them...
-------------------------------------------
I am pretty sure that the handle or shaft of the bat is pretty much like a golf club shaft. The "regular" flex, or the "stiff" flex obviously refers to the amount of give that a bat has, like a golf club. In my experience, the regular flex is "considered" better for power hitters because it gives them more "snap" on contact. But to me, that is really in a sense a contradictory statement due to the fact that a true power hitter should posess enough snap with his wrist's and have enough power generated throughout his swing with his core and legs that he should not need the extra snap offered by a regular flex bat. So, personally, I think it is a matter of personal preference on how the bat responds to your swing and point of contact. Hope this is somewhat helpful.
----------------------------------------
In golf...(imho) the stiffer stuff is for the harder / power swingers.
Check out tiger's or whoever's swing....thier clubs flex but not much.
Question 13: Ok, let's get off the golf swing. I'm looking to purchase a new set of clubs. What's the number 1 thing I should consider before everything else?
The shaft flex beyond a doubt. The shaft is the "engine" of the club. For the record, most players play with a shaft flex which is too stiff and they're unable to "load" the shaft properly for a long, powerful hit. But shaft flex is not entirely dependent on how fast you swing the club. For example, Fred Couples plays a weaker shaft than Nick Price who plays a stiffer shaft, even though Price generates less clubhead speed! Couples swings relatively slowly while Price swings fast. Couples, amazingly enough, though, generates more clubhead speed than Price but needs a weaker shaft because he swings the club so slowly.
------------------------------------
I agree WNYCoach. This is why I said that "in my experience, the regular flex shaft is considered" to be for power hitters. I did not make myself very clear until later when I mentioned that this was contradictory. Sorry for the confusion.
-----------------------------------
Distance isn't everything in golf, stiffer shaft = more accurcacy and possibly less distance. Those guys are looking for a balance between distance and accuracy.
Don't forget that you're dealing with a longer flexing shaft in golf than with a baseball bat. In a golf club's shaft, there is maore involved than simply its flex. There are kick points and torque involved also. Kick point determines trajectory and torque determines the club head's twist which translates into accuracy. Those don't play as big a role in baseball bat flex handles because they're shorter.
You're not thinking club speed either, you're thinking tempo. Tempo in a golf swing has absolutley nothing to do with what shaft you need. Price swings "faster" because he has a quicker tempo than Couples. In reality, Couples has a faster club speed, so he's using a stiffer shaft, not a weaker shaft than Price, check your source there. Here's another problem with what you're saying: If Price is swinging a weaker shaft than Couples and Price swings faster, then either Price would be slicing the ball because the clubhead would be dragging too much, or Couples would be hooking the ball because the clubhead wouldn't be dragging enough. I would really like to know where you got your information from on those two because it simply doesn't make sense.
Rule of thumb: The more bat head speed you have the stiffer handle bat you want because you don't want the barrel to drag through the zone. More bat head speed = more distance. More distance = power hitter. Therefore a power hitter wants a bat with a stiffer handle.
------------------------------------
Easton's stiff handle option is a marketing response to the basic engineering/physics problem - a stiff handle is generally a better design in a baseball bat.
----------------------------------------
im a high school payer (sophmore) and it seems like everyone thats anyone around here is buying the stiff handles. ive tried both out. the regular handle is good for opposite field hits becuase of the bend. but i think the stiff one is better all around.
-----------------------------------------
bat will barely flex. can u bend it even using ur foot!? Compar flex on a golf club shaft.
-----------------------------------------
Plaz...it's not just during the swing...it's during contact!!! That's the problem, the handle flexes at contact and the barrel trampoline effect has decreased it's effect on the ball. I can flex my son's old Vexum -13 with a hand at each end.
Search for Physics of Baseball and Sweet spot to learn about that topicc
-----------------------------------------
Right thats a kids bat. I dont think an adult bat will flex. The bat needs to flex before it hits the ball to help it. So that it can "unflex" at the release point which gives it the extra whip, stored potential energy. Now is the ball hit at the release point? Proly not... would be hard. If the bat flexes when it hits the ball ( between the handle and the sweet spot ) I realy dont think its gana unflex before the ball leaves the bat. I may be wrong proly am.. but maybe right . its a fun discussion. but coming from golf and seeing lots of customized shafts, I dont see how flex can have anything to do with it. Large sweet spot would be more potential distance over a series of many hits.
---------------------------------------
I just got through reading a bunch of stuff on bat physics, BESR certification, etc. A discussion on stiff versus flex probably needs to be divided into two categories. BESR certified bats and non-BESR certified bats. If you are talking about BESR certified bats then all bats perform the same as a 34 inch wood bat because that is the limiting standard for ball exit speed. Then the discussion may need to revolve around durability of the bat and the ability of the bat to maintain new bat performance.
If you are talking about non-BESR bats then there is some variation of ball exit speed depending on whose physics you are buying. For non-BESR bats, it looks like stiff bats are better than flex bats, because this allows the barrel to flex more increasing the trampoline effect. The worst that can happen is a flex bat that flexes too much on impact absorbing the collision energy and cannot rebound fast enough to return the energy to the ball (dead bat). Probably the interesting thing is that it appears that BESR certified bats will not perform as well as non-certified bats because BESR bats have been scaled back to perform the same as wood bats.